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Thread: The Aeneid

  1. #21
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Following up on Champlin's questions about who Phaedrus is I find connections to Abaris and Rome which mimic issues regarding Orpheus of Thracian origin and Pythagoras writing much or at least some of the Bard's works. Could Abaris (who taught Pythagoras) be an author too?

    A new general biographical dictionary

    Hugh James Rose, ‎Henry John Rose, ‎Thomas Wright - 1857 - ‎Biography
    PHiEDRUS, a Latin fabulist, was a native of Thrace, probably brought to Rome at ... The matter is generally borrowed from jEsop, but Phaedrus intermixes stories ... There is extant a series of letters under the names of Phalaris and Abaris, the ...

    And more fruit falls in my search as I again find a most credible ancient historian named Poseidonius whose work I often say was targeted for destruction by Empire builders seeking to appear more grandiose in inventions of technology and in culture.

    "(294) As for the southern part of Germany beyond the Albis, the portion which is just contiguous to that river is occupied by the Suevi; then immediately adjoining this is the land of the Getae, which, though narrow at first, 295stretching as it does along the Ister on its southern side and on the opposite side along the mountain-side of the Hercynian Forest p175(for the land of the Getae also embraces a part of the mountains), afterwards broadens out towards the north as far as the Tyregetae; but I cannot tell the precise boundaries. It is because of men's ignorance of these regions that any heed has been given to those who created the mythical "Rhipaean Mountains"51 and "Hyperboreans,"52 and also to all those false statements made by Pytheas the Massalian regarding the country along the ocean, wherein he uses as a screen his scientific knowledge of astronomy and mathematics.53 So then, those men should be disregarded; in fact, if even Sophocles, when in his role as a tragic poet he speaks of Oreithyia,54 tells how she was snatched up by "Boreas" and carried "over the whole sea to the ends of the earth and to the sources of night55 and to the unfoldings of heaven56 and to the ancient garden of Phoebus,"57 his story can have no bearing on the present inquiry, but should be disregarded, just as it is disregarded by Socrates in the Phaedrus.58 But let us confine our narrative to what we have learned from history, both ancient and modern.

    2 Now the Greeks used to suppose that the Getae were Thracians; and the Getae lived on either side the Ister, as did also the Mysi, these also being Thracians and identical with the people who are now called Moesi; from these Mysi sprang also the Mysi who now live between the Lydians and the p177Phrygians and Trojans. And the Phrygians themselves are Brigians, a Thracian tribe, as are also the Mygdonians, the Bebricians, the Medobithynians,59 the Bithynians, and the Thynians, and, I think, also the Mariandynians. These peoples, to be sure, have all utterly quitted Europe, but the Mysi have remained there. And Poseidonius seems to me to be correct in his conjecture that Homer designates the Mysi in Europe (I mean those in Thrace) when he says, "But back he turned his shining eyes, and looked far away towards the land of the horse-tending Thracians, and of the Mysi, hand-to‑hand fighters"60 for surely, if one should take Homer to mean the Mysi in Asia, the statement would not hang together. Indeed, when Zeus turns his eyes away from the Trojans towards the land of the Thracians, it would be the act of a man who confuses the continents and does not understand the poet's phraseology to connect with Thrace the land of the Asiatic Mysi, who are not "far away," but have a common boundary with the Troad and are situated behind it and on either side of it, and are separated from Thrace by the broad Hellespont; for "back he turned" generally61 means "to the rear," and he who transfers his gaze from the Trojans to the people who are either in the rear of the Trojans 296or p179on their flanks, does indeed transfer his gaze rather far, but not at all "to the rear."62 Again, the appended phrase63 is testimony to this very view, because the poet connected with the Mysi the "Hippemolgi" and "Galactophagi" and "Abii," who are indeed the wagon-dwelling Scythians and Sarmatians. For at the present time these tribes, as well as the Bastarnian tribes, are mingled with the Thracians (more indeed with those outside the Ister, but also with those inside). And mingled with them are also the Celtic tribes — the Boii, the Scordisci, and the Taurisci. However, the Scordisci are by some called "Scordistae"; and the Taurisci are called also "Ligurisci"64 and "Tauristae."65

    3 Poseidonius goes on to say of the Mysians that in accordance with their religion they abstain from eating any living thing, and therefore from their flocks as well; and that they use as food honey and milk and cheese, living a peaceable life, and for this reason are called both "god-fearing" and "capnobatae";66 and there are some of the Thracians who live apart from woman-kind; these are called "Ctistae,"67 and because of the honour in which they are held, have been dedicated to the gods and live with freedom from every fear; p181accordingly, Homer speaks collectively of all these peoples as "proud Hippemolgi, Galactophagi and Abii, men most just," but he calls them "Abii" more especially for this reason, that they live apart from women, since he thinks that a life which is bereft of woman is only half-complete (just as he thinks the "house of ProtesilaŘs" is only "half complete," because it is so bereft);68 and he speaks of the Mysians as "hand-to‑hand fighters" because they were indomitable, as is the case with all brave warriors; and Poseidonius adds that in the Thirteenth Book69 one should read "Moesi, hand-to‑hand fighters" instead of "Mysi, hand-to‑hand fighters." "*.html
    Last edited by R_Baird; 04-08-2016 at 10:44 AM.

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Having mentioned the disappearance of the Ostrogoths before, in this thread, it is relevant to include connections with it and the total lie we call history.

    We owe so much to our ancestors who travelled this Earth sharing knowledge and rebuilding the human race after natural cataclysms. Why have we denied their existence?

    Why is it that academia errs so much on history and we see the same errors repeat even after DNA has now proven linguists were correct in the mid 19th Century? There had been so many other forensic sciences before DNA which supported what a team of Smithsonian experts said about the Old Copper Culture of the northern Mississippi and Lake Superior and yet academics like Susan Martin of a nearby podunk university in Saginaw, were aggressively calling any and all comers - "liars" and going about saying things which include outright lies herself. I offered to debate her anywhere at any time just as I did with the Dean of Studies at Trent University who lied about what I said. Doug Weller of the demonramtops website was as bad or worse. The reason - I say --- they are paid to lie and the better they lie or succeed in keeping a lid on true history allows them to continue to get paid. Other institutions like the Canadian Museum of Civilization had to change their name when proven guilty of these lies. Now they are saying they want to do serious study of Manitoulin Island ancient mines over 100,000 years old which they allowed to be built over, and which they have all the proof they need, ferretted away after almost killing, robbing and hounding Rousseau (Their own former head man.) and Dr. Lee into ruination. There are many other examples of artifact destruction with intent to deceive, including the Peterborough Petroglyphs and Barry Fell's work there which Susan Martin offered to debate and yet did not do what she offered.

    All over the world nations are founded upon serious lies, and the laws based on the concepts of the religions telling humans such lies are likewise a serious problem. HUMANITY IS NOT AS BAD AS WE ARE TOLD!!!! A few elite people have wrought the devil into existence and it is their acts which show what true evil is.

    Yes, the linguists knew other science and artifacts were needed to prove the worldwide culture of Brotherhood developed mankind and his wonderful and often loving culture. Then some of them were taken out of context or made to seem in support of concepts like we saw with the Nazis. Racism has been a fundamental tool against mankind and misogyny has been it's bedmate. It continues to this day and it often includes ignorant people who actually believe the lies, doing exactly what the Nazis did - all over again. I am using the word Nazi for an elite who also tried to oust FDR and are responsible for Pinochet and Stalin along with many others.

    "The comparison of languages is perhaps incapable of affording all the results which some persons have anticipated from it. It would be too much to expect from this quarter to demonstrate the unity of race, or an original sameness of idiom in the whole human species. But this resource, if properly applied, will furnish great and indispensable assistance in many particular inquiries relating to the history and affinity of nations.

    It would be easy to point out instances in which the examination of languages has rendered substantial and undoubted services to the historian. The history of the Goths, who conquered the Roman empire, will furnish an example. The real origin of this people could not have been known with certainty, if we had not come into possession of an ample specimen of their language in the version of Ulphilas. By this we learn that they were not Getse or Thracians, as most of the writers who lived near to the era of the Gothic invasion supposed them to be, and as some modern historians have maintained; but, in conformity with their own traditions, nearly allied in kindred to the northern tribes of the German family. {There being Visigoths and Ostrogoths - the latter having disappeared and history gives lies as to why and where they went - where lots of proof now exists - they went to Peru.}

    The origin of the Polynesian races has been illustrated by an investigation in one respect similar. {Their Ainu blood is in Peru as well.}

    Some of these tribes are found in islands so distant from all other inhabited regions, as to furnish an argument in favour of the opinion, that they had the beginning of their existence in their present abodes. But a comparison of their languages has furnished proof that all the most remote insular nations of the Great Ocean derived their origin from the same quarter, and are nearly related to some tribes of people inhabiting a part of the Indian continent and the isles of the Indian archipelago. {See the noted linguist Clyde Winters in the thread on the Tamil Siddhar I connect with the DNN Sidhe.}

    Even the history of the African and American tribes has been in many particulars elucidated by an inquiry into the relations of their languages, though the results which have been obtained have not proved to be precisely those which were hypothetically anticipated, and with hope of arriving at which these researches were in part undertaken. {The breaking of the Mayan code a few years ago revives hope in Brotherhood thinking as averse to the presentation of savages by the real heathens who burned both libraries and librarians since the era of Bishop Landa whose own writings proved great culture and civilization proof.}

    Philologists have sought in vain in the old continent for a nation, from whose speech the diversified idioms of America may with any degree of probability be derived ; but an examination of the American languages themselves has led to some interesting results. The native races of North America are referred by a classification of their dialects to a few great divisions, several of which extend as radii issuing from a common centre in the north-western part of the continent, where it is divided from Asia by Behring's Strait. The traditions prevalent among the ancient Mexicans seem to have derived credit from the discovery of a chain of nations extending almost from New Mexico to Mount St. Elias, in the neighbourhood of the Esquimaux Tsehugazzi ; their languages, particularly those of the Ugalyachmutzi and Koluschians, bearing a curious analogy to that of the Aztecs and Tlaxcallans. Another series of nations, the Karalit, or Esquimaux, connected by affinities of dialect, has been traced from the settlements of the Tschuktschi in Asia, along the polar zone to Acadia and Greenland. Light has also been thrown in a similar manner on the history of the Lenni Lenape, and the great kindred family of Algonquin nations, {Researchers recently working to show Navajo far to the south have the same linguistic roots. Check into Topper's top archy named Goodyear who has blown the lid off the Clovis lie and takes the settling back to 50,000 years ago - see others like Guidon and Carter going back much further -etc.} on that of the Iroquois, and likewise of the Floridian and other races of North America, by a comparison of their national traditions with the indications discovered in their dialects.

    One circumstance, which is perhaps of more importance than all the preceding, is the singular congruity in structure between all the American languages, from the northern to the southern extremity of the continent {Thomas Jefferson observed this but his researches were lost crossing the Potomac River and he never got back to the work.}. To this I only allude at present, having already in another place surveyed the facts on which the observation is founded, as they have been developed by the researches of Barton, Hervas, Von Humboldt, Heckewelder, and Duponceau. In Africa a remarkable and interesting fact was the discovery of a nation occupying nearly the whole northern region of that continent, to which the Kabyles of Mauritania and the Tuarik of the Great Desert belong, and whose branches extend from the Oasis of Siwah on the eastern, to the mountains of Atlas, and even to the Canary islands, on the western side; the Guanches, the old inhabitants of those islands, whose remains are said to lie embalmed in the mummy caves {The same techniques used in Peru and Scotland.} of Teneriffe, spoke, as it appears, a dialect of the same language as the Kabyles and Berbers."

    "Full text of "The eastern origin of the Celtic nations proved by a comparison of their dialects with the Sanskrit, Greek, Latin, and Teutonic languages : forming a supplement to Researches into the physical history of mankind""

    The last comment supported later by Barry Fell. There is a tribe in Africa who came to the region near Venezuela and elsewhere who have six fingers - one of whom was in Major League Baseball and they have been in South America for at least ten millennia. The RH factor of the Pima Indians and a thousand other things from top scholars like Nuttall, Meggars, Kelley, Coe, Kehoe, Lopatin, Jennings, Dillehay, Chatters, Leakey etc..

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Do you believe what you read in the paper today? Which side of the event do you believe? Is either one correct? When you look back on the event a month later after reading more accounts does your opinion of the first accounts change?

    The following link mentions Hecateus was the first to use the word 'keltoi' in 500 BCE. I doubt that for many reasons including the word Celt is a roman epithet to diminish the 'kelts' and earlier cultures they stole and fought from and with. When was the first time 'Celt' was used to describe a people rather than the hammered tool made from early alloying caused in fires like those set to cause rock to break and release gold or gems? That is called Spalling and it was probably used before Dolni Vestonici double kiln technology and ceramic making in 27,000 BCE. Hammered tool - in case you do not know, is synonymous with a drunken lout. That is the kind of history that survived Empire and was still being written by Hume in the era of Gibbon who wrote the definitive book on Rome. That is what books used in schools still pass along as fact.

    Though the following says we have many ancient historians and geographers and the books they wrote - they do not. The works of Poseidonius are quoted by others and I think his originals were too instructive about the origins of actual inventions and culture so they had to be destroyed. His work is quoted by Herodotus who was ridiculed for writing fictions (now proven by archaeology - Amazons and Sybaris are examples). Then there is the usual matter of journalists writing things to appease or please their masters or employers. The Senchus Mor told the history of the Kelts for 25,000 years and thus it was a primary target for elimination and doctoring by the likes of St. Patrick who we have proof did just that. Strabo wrote that the Kelts of the Iberian Peninsula had a 7500 year written history. Those people were a colony of Iberia where white people originated - the Caucasus. Tiflis is the name for Iberia today and that name only came to our history in the 20th Century. Roma and Greece were not even glints in the eyes of the Phoenician Keltoi in this era.

    "The Celts of the distant north have not yet taken to writing, but we have many accounts of people who have been to their lands or who have talked to people who have. The Carthaginian Himilcar was one of the first people to leave an account of the area. Hecataeus of Miletus (c 500B.C.), an early geographer and writer, was the first to use the term "Keltoi". His works are quoted by the later Herodotus (c. 450 B.C.). Pytheas of Massalia (4th century B.C.) spoke of an island called Brettanike. He travelled there and possibly beyond around 310 - 306 B.C. Theopompus' 4th century B.C. account of Philip II of Macedon includes his contacts with the Keltoi. Hieronymus of Cardia and Phylarchus, both of the 3rd century B.C., wrote about the customs of the Keltoi. Marinus wrote about the Keltoi in the 1st century B.C. Poseidonius' first-hand account of Gaul in the 1st century B.C. is much quoted by Diodorus Siculus (1st century B.C.), and Strabo (25 A.D.). There is also a copy of a Greek inscription in Upper Egypt (185 B.C.) that tells how some mercenaries with Greek names caught a fox or jackal. From the inscription it is obvious that the mercenaries were, in fact, Keltoi."

    And the hits just keep on coming! History is a web of lies where people call other people ignorant or unable to write or travel, or even think and be conscious (John Locke and the Pope during the heathen invasion of paradise or Bountiful in America). But the people before the second millennium BCE in this report, traveled and traded in the whole area from Egypt to Denmark. I say they did this back to the time before the last Ice Age and Callanish is one example of what they left behind.

    "After taking a new look at a pair of ancient cobalt beads, archaeologists now believe these Bronze Age artifacts may have been manufactured in the same workshop as the blue glass on King Tut’s death mask.

    If that’s the case, an extensive trade network likely ran from ancient Denmark to Egypt and Mesopotamia around 3,400 years ago, the researchers say.

    For the research, an international team of Danish and French archaeologists used a technique called plasma-mass spectrometry to analyze the chemical composition of 23 glass beads dating back to between 1400 and 1100 B.C. The set of beads was unearthed from Danish graves in the late 19th century.

    The analysis revealed that two cobalt beads in the set contained the same trace elements as glass made in Egypt around the same time, which suggests they came from the same region. In fact, the researchers say the new discovery is the first Egyptian cobalt glass that has been found outside the Mediterranean area."
    Last edited by R_Baird; 04-22-2016 at 12:22 AM.

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